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 Post subject: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 5:31 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 6:26 pm
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Location: Garstang
I read on the post outside the Knott End Cafe that the appearance of the Big Hole (on top of general subsidence and flooding) helped cause the demise of the salt mines. Is there any sign of the Big Hole now? What areas around Knott End did the salt mines cover? Is the business now completely defunct?


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:56 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:22 pm
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Location: Fleetwood
Phil,

The salt mines that collapsed were actually in Stalmine...not really Knott End, but close enough as the crow flies I suppose.

Here's an old posting of mine that, so long as you've got broadband and are capable of watching a short video (make sure your speakers are turned on) should answer your questions:


http://wyrearchaeology.blogspot.com/200 ... ansas.html

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http://www.wyrearchaeology.blogspot.com


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 7:10 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:49 pm
Posts: 230
Brian,

Many thanks for that link, don't know how I missed it. I've passed it on to FGS were it made a big hit, lots of people commented on how interesting it was. Many of them know the area well, but no logner live there, so you've done a public service...go directly to the next garden party at Buck House, pass Go and collect £200-00p.

Terry


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 8:25 pm 
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Terry,

I should perhaps point out that I didn't actually make the video...or do the voice over or anything. I seem to recall that I came across it at Google Videos one night and thought, "That'd look good on the blog." As well as the obvious political message, it's also an excellent potted history of the salt mines.

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http://www.wyrearchaeology.blogspot.com


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 8:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 6:26 pm
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Location: Garstang
Most informative link! Did the landowners make a killing on the extraction in the same way that owners of land above coal seams did?


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:26 pm 
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Actually Phil, I suspect they lost quite a bit when the market collapsed...namely their houses, fields, hedges, sheep and anything else that dropped into the holes.

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http://www.wyrearchaeology.blogspot.com


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:35 am 
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Location: Garstang
So the mineral rights were owned by many people actually living there? And they probably never saw a penny from the extractions whereas the aristocratic landowners over coalmines got fortunes!


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:51 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:32 am
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Location: Preston
Depends, I lived in a village outside Northwich where ICI owned most of the land and though my house was 'freehold' I seem to remember that ICI owned the mineral rights.
Incidentally ICI extracted brine from beneath the fields there by pumping in water and dissolving the salt and came up with a plan to store ethylene gas (used by their factory near Runcorn to produce polyethylene) in the caverns created by the process. I was chair of a residents' action group which fought the proposal on the basis that the gas was highly explosive (used to clear minefields in Vietnam)but we lost. Ironically the local council contained many ICI employees and though many supported us, when it came to a vote they had to declare an interest and abstain. We appealed to the Secretary of State but he ruled in favour of the plan too. The salt caverns were indeed filled with ethylene gas; the nearest one was about 600 yards from our houses and when the gas was 'flared' you could hear the noise and (I'm convinced) the heat too. ICI did treat us all to a day out on Teesside to see how successful they had been there. Ever been to Middlesbrough?

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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:02 pm 
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Location: Garstang
Presumably person or persons owned all the land before the salt extractors appeared on the scene. I assumed that, if I owned a piece of land, I also owned the mineral rights below unless the terms of sale stipulated otherwise. Am I wrong and can an extractor buy the rights to extract under my land?


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:44 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 1:04 pm
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Location: just outside the fort
Brian,
An interesting video, which I hadnt seen before, with the history of the salt industry here, a lot of which I wasn't aware of. Here's a not very good photo of one of the craters I took last year.

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 9:24 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:22 pm
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Frank,

I have a suspicion that's the one on the top of the height-o'-t'-hill. If it is, then I believe it's still subsiding...slowly but surely.

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http://www.wyrearchaeology.blogspot.com


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:42 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:49 pm
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Frank, would it be O.K if I passed the crater phot on to the FGS website? There's quite a bit of interest in the film and the area and I think your picture is particularly good.


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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:37 am 
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Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 1:04 pm
Posts: 614
Location: just outside the fort
Terry,
Any photos I post on this site can be used anywhere without asking, saves me a lot of typing!

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 Post subject: Re: Knott End`s Big Hole
PostPosted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:36 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:49 pm
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Frank, That is much appreciated.


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